Brown Widow Spider
Did you know that there are four types of Widow Spiders in Florida? They are the Northern Black Widow Spider, the Southern Widow Spider, the Red Widow Spider, and the Brown Widow Spider which will discuss in more detail below.
Although the venom of these spiders is not as toxic as the Black Widow, they are still very painful and can cause serious injury if not treated.
Because brown widow spiders (Latrodectus Geometricus) can vary from light tan to dark brown or almost black and may have different markings such as white, black, yellow, brown, and even orange on the back of their abdomen, they are tough to recognize! The picture below is of the red widow spider.
Brown Widow Egg Sac
You’ll notice the hourglass marking on the bottom of the abdomen, colored yellow or orange. The Egg Sac of the brown widow spider is not the same as other widows and has pointed projections, much like the old sea mines.
If you have pictures of this spider or believe a Brown Widow has bitten you, please post your comments below and send the photos to the email address at the bottom of this page.
Wow maybe I’m sensitive to the Brown Widow bites……I got a bite on my hand (no mark just slightly red if any I can’t see one really) but intense aching pain like I had broken it – the only thing that works is soaking it in Epson salts or taking Advil. It has been two weeks and I think today I can finally use my hand! Yay! That one person is right if it bites you on a tendon or muscle watch out! They love plastic furniture or really any patio chair (I am constantly having to check) they can suddenly appear and be there with an egg within 3 days of not looking – these guys are amazing. Please check your under your cars too at night they will always be hanging out where you can see them. My symptoms were a mild fever, intense migraine and a bit of nausea. Be careful in your yard when you see a ball of old leaves etc. since their webs are so sticky and strong – that ball will hide up to 5 eggs sometimes! The mother is usually hiding in there too! They do tend to build a kind of tight white barrier web next to the egg and hide like a tiny ball in a corner (they actually will drop and roll out) just use a long stick and check those corners for the parent before getting the egg off there.
I forgot to say I am also from Burbank, Ca. We are being over-run here!
Just had the privilage to watch a mudwasp kill, pull out of web, drop and after about 3 minutes find a brown widdow spider. Very interesting.
I was letting my dog out last night and something bit me on my leg it only burned and now it hurts LIKE HELL!!!!!!! I have found a brown widow under an outside chair and now it’s DEAD……LOL who has the last laugh now??????Ocala FL..P.S I killed her with RAID ant and roach spray,AND IT WORKS……
I’m in Burbank, ca and I found three eggs sacs in my tankless water heater 4 days ago. I mentioned them to the hubby who said they where spores. Didn’t think much of it but wasn’t 100% satisfied. Today,Saturday my daughter was outside playing with the sprinklers (not near the tank) and as I walked by I noticed why seemed to be thick web near the “spores”. I googled white spider eggs and sure enough my suspicion was cOnfirmed. My husband sprayed them with big killer but I think they need to be squiched. Will the spray work?
I live in Tallahassee, FL, and I had a lot of these living in my back yard around the pool. I found thier strange egg sacks first under the lid to the skimmer on the pool. We have three plastic chairs that sit by the pool, and i noticed they had webs around the legs. When I flipped them over, each chair had multiple egg sacks under it, and there were a total of five huge brown widows tending to the webs. They were all close to 2 inches across from leg to leg. I killed all the spiders with a stick, and gathered up all the carcasses and egg sacks and soaked them with lighter fluid and set them on fire (more for my entertainment than anything else). I was sitting in those chairs on a daily basis!
I live in Kansas, and a part that is infested with brown recluses, (on average I kill about 25 in my home each year, one year i killed over 50, 7 in one night, and this in normal for most people around here) it is the most common spider in this part of the state. Anyway, last year we had a really cold winter, one of top 3 coldest in 100 years, cold enough that it killed most of the spiders, last year we had very very few recluses (i killed 3 all year year, though 1 was 3 inches from my face!), however we then went on to have one of the top 3 hottest summers in 100 years, and by the end of the summer, the first offical report of a Brown Widow migrating up here was confirmed. So, this winter we had NO winter at all, (in the top 2 warmest in the last 100 years), and now it is spring.
Well, still very few recluses, though I have killed a couple and a relative has near infestation levels again, but about a month ago I noticed a baby spider by the bottom of my front door. it was a baby but it looked like a widow, so i captured it and kept it in a jar, til i could positively id it as a brown or black. A month later, with no food, the thing was still alive, and growing. So, I id’d it and it appears to be a male brown widow. Then in the past two days I have killed two of these things, then tonight i found 1 that was big enough i could capture it (and that was fun, recluses are easy to capture compared to these little brats) and id’d it as a female brown widow.
what scares me is these things are babies, and I’ve got 4 in plain veiw, and I know how prolificly they breed, so it makes me nervous, I am used to recluses, I have come to accept them, these things are new and scary.
Point is, they are now in Kansas, and probablly here to stay. Good news is they are not as bad as black widows, but I am afraid I am going to be seeing more. And what is really scary is that all 4 babies have been found inside.
I’ve had them swing out towards me when I got near the egg sac. The local chemical store sold me a bottle of potent spider killer ($150 for about 12 oz) and I spray the outside perimeter of my home and pool screen every six months. You use .5 oz per gal of water to dilute it in a sprayer can. Recently, the very small widow spiders have been blowing through the pool screen and into my pool. They get inside my swim suit and bite. Leaves an itchy red welt larger than a mosquito bite and last for a week. I’m guessing the larger widow spiders would leave a larger wound. I’ve been looking for photos of a brown widow spider bite but have not found any yet on the Internet. Have a bite on my back right now and it itches like heck.
I live on Marco Island. About a month ago I discovered a large brown widow web that stretched about 25 feet from a tree in our yard to the neighbor’s house. I noticed it would climb up into the tree during the day and every time it rains or the wind got strong it would rebuild in about two days but one of my friends destroyed the entire web with sticks and it hasn’t returned in about two weeks. It may not have built a web, but we had to kill it the other day when it decided to munch on a dead lizard in my bathroom. At least it didn’t bite me :/
today was working on the front yard and when i was getting the water hose to take around to the side of the house i notice a brown widow spider crawling on the bricks of the flower bed . i sprayed it with indoor and outdoor spray but don’t know if i killed it .it ran real quick . my concern was letting my cat outside .
Hi! We need help! We live in Florida, about 20 miles east of Daytona Beach, and have been inundated with brown widows!!!! We have 2 young children and the spiders seem to really enjoy hanging out and building their webs in the bottom of their toys, swings, and chairs (all plastic by the way) outside. I’ve killed a total of 7 since Saturday and one of the webs had already hatched and had tons of little brown widows scattering. Anything we can do to take care of them and protect our little ones? Any advice is welcome!!!
I have nvr heard of them before, but found two of them under the steps and an egg sack. KILLED THEM ALL.
Live in Kenner, Louisiana and just found a brown widow in our back yard under my 5 year olds table. Thankfully, we were cleaning/scrubbing everything from top to bottom and found it along with a couple of egg sacks. Needless to say, I’m freaked out and don’t want to go out back again! But knowing my luck, I may have one or two inside the house as well.
Sleeping with one eye open tonight. That’s for sure.
Brown Widow spiders are in Island of Kauai, HAWAII!!!!! When we first moved in the house in the beginning, our carport was fine over 2 yrs until I started notice big spider with bright red-orange hour glass shape only at night! I kinda knew its like black widow style spider, but the spider is not black. Just one wierd spider I never knew, then couple months later, it came more more hourglass spiders under kids toys, bike, n wagon. I have became more concern for me, two little daughters, gf, and friends’ safety. I began to research about those spiders. I was oh my gosh, brown widow spiders are poisons!! I killed over 20 trophy brown widow spiders with sacs!!! And over 30 small tiny babies brown widows. That’s 2nd round. At first round I didn’t even notice, but second round I knew bout them. Some are very aggressive n run fast toward to you. So I had to get rid of clutters boxes n toys out of carport. Hope it will be a lot less than before. I will hunt them down every month at night!!! No mercy for them!!!!
Just a note, Vee’s photo does NOT show a brown widow. The spider she collected is a harmless orb weaver (trust me, I’ve found plenty of them). he easiest identification is through the egg sacs, as you can see they look like spiky mines. Brown widows do NOT make orb shaped webs. Brown widows are more apparent than black because ether will stay in more urban areas. They also have a nasty habit of hiding around outdoor patios and recycling/trash bins. They are less aggressive than black widows, and will often curl up and drop out of their webs if threatened. However, their venom may be just as toxic. there is at least one case of a brown widow bite hospitalization.
We live in southeast Louisiana where we have been seeing black and brown widows. We saw and killed 5 browns this afternoon in about 30 minute time span. We are finding them on a regular basis. Is there a spray that works in an area? Or do you have to see the spider to spray it?
Found this nasty thing in my front door up in t he corner. She jumped out and tryed to run away but I stepped on it :D
Well, I just found my first brown widow spider. I wasn’ sure what it was at first, but after observing it from the underside of my outdoor lawn chair with it’s nest, cozily placed into the corner including it’s cream color spikly egg sac amidst the silky threads of its’ nest, I was convinced of my discovery. I had seen a black widow once about 10 years ago under lawn furniture as well. For this reason, I always check under lawn furniture before I sit down. I wanted to take a picture, but felt that I better kill it before it could get away. It ended up smeared to badly for a picture.
To Theresa that lives south of Sarasota. I lived in the same area as you for 30 years and just started seeing brown widows last year. They started around my detached garage, but today we found one inside. I had been spraying the ones on the garage with a spray I found at home depot that says it’s for spiders. Not sure what I am using inside yet.
Just thought you should know that they are probably inside by now. They seem to move to new locations very quickly. The good news is they aren’t aggressive. Check under furniture and in cabinets. I think the easiest way to find them is to watch for their fine webs. Good luck in your hunt… That’s what I have planned for tomorrow!
I am in Ft. Lauderdale Florida and there is a brown widow spider right outside the window of my office. I noticed the spider about 6 days ago and this morning when I looked out the window I noticed an egg sac.
I live in Fresno and i found several brown widows last summer in my garden. the web was frm rim of planter to the ground i saw the round bottom thinking it was a black widow NOT it was brown and orange hour glass.
They will play dead and they dont mind other spiders. They are faster than a black widow. I found 1 egg. be carefull they setup anywhere fast check before touching.
I live in Orange, Ca. I just found one this evening under the rack my hose is on near my front door. It looks exactly like a brown widow picture I found on the internet. I had no idea there was a brown species.
Last year we housed a black one on our porch. Only saw her at night, and she behaved. One day we found her legs and knew she had passed. Tonight we killed the brown one.
To Angela in Costa Mesa, CA: You must kill that spider – you are not doing any one any favors by letting it live. Spray that area with Raid (I like the lemon fresh scent) and then look for other hiding places and spray them too. You do not hear of Brown Widow spider bites too often – at least I don’t – but the potential for serious harm is there. Kill them All – they are not endangered :) and there are PLENTY of them that we don’t need them in our neighborhoods.
I care for friends’ dogs and I see plenty of Brown Widows (more so than black) in yards around here. Specifically at residences in wher I have worked in Anaheim, Placentia, and Westminster – but they are everywhere in So Cal, Costa Mesa is no exception.
I just was at my friend’s house in Westminster and cleared about a dozen spiny egg sacs out of the handle area of two of those city-issued trash recepticles. Widows LOVE those spots. In my spraying, I did see two Brown Widows. (One had a live bee it was beginning to ready for dinner. I would have loved to have videotaped it, but I was pressed for time).
Once I put my hand on the front side handle area to re-position the trash container and felt something odd. I pulled my hand out and had webbing and a sleepy/lethargic spider attached to my fingers. I immediately shook my hand and the webbing and spider fell off. That is how I discovered that they love those spots. This occurred in Anaheim and at that house and outside area where the dogs were at, I pretty much eradicated the Black Widow population: Spraying Raid weekly in their favorite areas. (No, I am not dellusional, I know that there may have been many more in deep hiding – well out of the way – but I am not concerned about those :)
Don’t know any alternatives to chemicals, but I’ve found Raid – the Ant and Roach version – to work quite well. The lemon scent variety leaves the area smelling nice, though don’t think it is “safe” to breath.
I live in Costa Mesa, Ca. and was walking up to my front door and noticed HUGE brown widow on its web between the step and the rail and my cat is only a year old and is an indoor cat, but i like to let her hang out on the porch during the day and now I’m totally terrified if this brown widow could harm my cat? Does anyone have any knowledge on this issue? Please and thanks!
I am not certain but that maybe Lyme Disease and not a brown recluse bite. does she have muscles spasms unexplained arthritis or aches and pains and nerve issues like lightening pains or pins and needles or burning pain that seems to not have any explaining. migraines that no one seems to care or connect to the rash when it flares up or maybe even when it isn’t there?
Cause a brown recluse bite if done right the area of muscle will have to be cut out sometimes or the infection can be so bad that it will get in blood stream but not after that many years my bite I think though I was told was a brown recluse I think was a tick and Lyme disease cause all the issues I have now that no one will listen to me.
…17 years later…
I was pregnant and the hospital told me they could give me antibotics but not a antidote. I didn’t know what that meant at the time but I believe now I do and now my kid is 17 and has had issues too like mine and hurt the same and no one cares. its tough cause the damage is done and can’t be proven but if you are still having the rash then maybe you can have it tested to see and treated before permanent damage is done.
its not fun and hurts a hell of a lot I can’t even work now from the pain. but I have never heard of a brown recluse bite lasting that many years. now a brown widow maybe cause its a mix of black and brown recluse so what it can do is truly unknown for time frame. I would gather not many though have it come back year after year that is why I think its Lyme Disease. but I am not a doctor so have it checked out is all I can say by a professional and good luck.
Hello, I am in NY we usually don’t have Brown Widows but I had lived in Texas and MS and moved up here 8 years ago and I had a friend that came back and forth from TX for years up till March of 2011 so the spiders I see around my apt could be brown widows she accidentally brought up in her trips unaware. or it maybe some new varied breed for NY I don’t know but it has really freaked the hell out of me I was biten by a brown recluse years ago and so I know that pain and hell all too well and don’t look foreward to a brown widow bite.
not one bit from what I have read about them I don’t have a camera so I can’t take a pic but ours are brown with dark brown to black spots on the joints and grey back sacs with brown marks down the backs and on the bottom it is a brown hourglass and grey it looks like some orange on the top but it is very light so I am not sure I have looked and can’t find any that look exactly the males are darker brown with black joints and little brown backs but I haven’t been able to preserve a male yet.
I have seen them around my doorways under my stairs and in corners under my storage bins and in corners and hell I have come close to getting bitten to many times to count thank god they are not aggressive and run from me two came out of my shoes one day one out my shirt I pulled out of my dresser and one fell on me while sitting in my chair under the stairs.
I have preserved one to give to my bugman to have it analyzed this Friday to make sure I am certain its a hybrid but if its a NY varied or one brought up from Texas I don’t know yet. but thought I would let you know and when I get a yeah it is a brown widow or no its not I will let you know.
I live just south of Sarasota Florida. I was just sweeping the millions of spiderwebs out of the lanai and came across 3 brown widow spiders and a dozen spiny egg sacs… I’m more than slightly concerned.. I haven’t seen any IN the house, just around it today (I just moved in 6 months ago) Should I be scared??
I found one today in my flower pot. Actually I found the 3 or 4 eggs sacks on a leaf then I turned the pot over (this pot had a rim on it) and found the spider with another 6 egg sacks . I had been keeping this plant in my house in a spare room for the winter.
I manage a self storage business in central Georgia. Brown Widows are everywhere here. Just a word of caution if you have a storage unit. Beware.
Brown spider, I don’t think it’s a brown widow (no obvious markings) Sending you two pictures…. Would LOVE your opinion since this is the third one I’ve found around my house. Live in Trenton Florida and I can not find a picture that matches these spiders…. Thanks, Tim
I found a spider appearing to be some kind of widow spider
Similar to the brown widow, Tan in color, striped legs, and a dark brown hour glass on its belly. Any clue what it might be?
One of my friends was sitting at home and said he saw a spider crawling out of the corner of his eye so he got up and caught it with a pair of pliers and he took a picture and posted it to Facebook. This spider is very ugly looking and he said he did some research on the internet and its a brown widow spider.
I think its a good thing he caught it before it bit anyone in his house, but he took it outside instead of killing it. I think he should have killed it but its a really nasty looking spider and when I saw the picture of it I told him that it was creepy. I have a thing with spiders. They creep me out.
We live in Huntington Beach and we found these spiders in our backyard including on the children’s outside play things (bikes, swings, wagons, climbing structure, under the lip of toys, you name it.) If anyone is interested in a natural remedy, I’ve use Simple Green and liberally spray the stuff into the cracks and crevices of the toys where they like to hide and just waited for the spiders to come crawling out and then I squash them. I also use a wind-resistent lighter to burn the egg sacs to ensure they don’t hatch (the eggs are really strong.) Works great and I don’t mind spraying the toys down because Simple Green is natural and non-toxic, and kills the spiders.
Hey: KRISTI your spider looks like a wolf-spider mixed with brown-widow just because of the red color on his butt yours might be a female spider because its fat maybe, you should look up wolf-spiders and you’ll see they both look the same
We see a lot of Brown widow spiders in Orlando, FL and occasionally black widows. This brown widow made a home very quickly in front of our doggie door when we stopped using it for a few days after one of my dogs injured his leg. I sprayed it with spider spray, but it quickly ran away. Not sure if I killed it or not since it ran away so quickly.
Found this brown widow today in Darien, Ct. It was cold and the spider was quite inactive. Found several of the spiky egg sacks as well.
I work at a liquor store here in rural West-Central Louisiana. I had a lot of cases of brandy half-pints in my back seat that I was transporting from one store to another for my boss. As I was bending into the back seat of my car to pick up some cases, I noticed EIGHT of the Brown Widows’ spiked, white egg sacks in the hinge of my car door. I haven’t noticed any of the spiders themselves, but where there’s smoke there’s fire and where there are spider eggs there are spiders. I’m going to spray the egg sacks directly with Raid Wasp and Hornet killer as soon as I get home (man I’m dreading that drive, as I’m afflicted with a terminal case of the willies where spiders are concerned), since I’ve found that to be a very effective pesticide in the past.
I want to be THOROUGH, though, so I’m considering using a fumigator inside my car. I don’t know if this is a great idea, but I can’t think of any other way to eradicate ALL of these dangerous (and creepy) spiders.
Any input or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
I wondered onto this site trying to find info to back up whether it’s possible for a female black widow “not to have” ANY markings. I have so many black widows around my house that I began studying them. I’m at the point I can id them them by body alone regardless of size. I still catch them to study them under a magnified light. I caught 2 today, same location. Obvious body structure & color. They don’t however have ANY markings on their back or abdomen.
I’ve read several other posts and thought I’d share information I learned from a friend that is a exterminator / wildlife specialist. He states that red widows; although still rare and hard to find a lot of info about; are considered the most venomous of the widow species, 2nd- brown widow (which is also more aggressive) and 3rd – black widow. With all widow species; the female is the one that carries the “venomous” bite. All spiders are venomous to a degree or couldn’t kill their prey. The male widows carry no more of a venomous bite than that of other spiders. Male and female blacks look completely different in size; markings and body structure. I’ve captured well over 40 in the 3 yrs in my house and studied them all. In my opinion they are fairly docile unless aggressively provoked.
Lastly, not to offend anyone, but I found a few of the posts concerning. 1) who knowingly lets a spider continue to bite them for id purposes. Grab something close at hand and capture it. Once contained in a closed container you can safely study as long as you want. As an EMT of 20 years I can’t tell you of the jeopardy you put yourself in by allowing that; let alone the extremely painful symptoms. 2) For the person that called the police for a widow spider. Tell me your joking. That’s not what serve and protect means; and not responding definitely isn’t being lazy. As far as your dog; pit bull or not, dogs are just as capable of being bitten regardless of breed.
well i thought i seen it all…
well found a black widow in my apartment, then a week later found what i thought looked like a brown widow i said no way a brown widow but look at the legs their kinda like bony to look at just seems like they would have no problem putting their legs around a 6 sided object
I was biten by a brown widow spider just over a week ago on Monday 11/28/2011; it bit me by my ankle. The bite mark has made changes through the days. The actual bite felt like someone was directly burning me with a cigarette, so I went to look at what was making my ankle burn, and to my surprise it was a spider. I allowed it to keep biting me, so I could identify it, and it hurt badly; I really wanted to make sure what it was, so I could tell the Dr., so he could tell me what I should do, mind you I was just diagnosed with pneumonia 2 days prior. He ordered me to wash my ankle thoroughly and prescribed cephlexin. Stupidity on my part, I have not taken the antibiotic.
Anyhow, about an hour after the bite, I started to feel pain on my right side of my body: ankle, right thigh, butt cheek, lower abdomen, right side of my back, and even a headache on the right side of my head. Today is Tuesday 12/6/2011, and my right side of my lower back still ache; my ankle still has pain like I sprained it, and I have had a puss head on the spider bite a few times (meaning I had a puss head on it 2 days after the bite, and my husband popped it; then, the puss came back the end of the day, and he popped it again, and it keeps coming back after he pops it). Today, there is a new purplish halo surrounding the area I was biten. Has anyone ever heard a that from a brown widow?
I live close to El Dorodo park in Long Beach, Ca and periodically find these fairly large dark brown spiders. They are usually hidden but they run very very fast. The thing that really creeped me out was a week or so ago I put my son in his crib and a spider began running back and forth on the mattress. I always shake out the blanket so I’m not sure if it flew out of there or was hiding next to the wall but it wouldn’t leave. My son has been bitten before by what I assume are spiders and I would really like to know what I am dealing with. The look very angular and mean.
Also, I drove home and there was a very large similar looking lighter spider with a body shape just like a giant black widow. It was hanging down from our tree and hit my windshield. I tried to take some pictures but the lighting makes it hard to see the color. Either way does anyone have advice? I don’t really want to use pesticides but am afraid my children will be bitten.
OMG I just found one in my backyard. I tried to hit it with the tip of my towel but it quickly ran up in to the corner of the wall. It sat there for a good two minutes giving me the evil eye. I went in to the house to call my next door neighbor. When he arrived we both went outside with a can of bug spray but, the spider was gone. I am now waiting for my husband to get home, he will have to find this thing or else we are dead tonight, the way that spider gave me the evil eye I am sure of it. The kids will have to stay with their grandparents tonight. I called the Police department over two ours ago, they tried to pawn me off to Animal control and it has been an hour since they promised to come around.
I know this brown widow wont mess with my dog ( he’s a Pitbull ) but Im not risking my dog’s life because the police are to lazy to protect us.
Does any body have any suggestions?
Hello, everybody apparently here in southern cali we have an infestation, I went down the homestore (depot) to buy a 2 gal canister for $14.99 and a concentrated can of poison for $8.99 got home used it, and these brown widows fell death within minutes a whole bunch it must of been at least 30-40 the product worked just fine better than orkins which were charging $60 a month and would take care of the problem, with $25 I took care of it and there’s still some left waiting for the next wave of brown widow if they dare.
i live in Savannah, GA and i have brown widows everywhere in my garage. i went on a spider killing spree and found that bleach will eat away the spider web and kill the babies.
I live in Southeast Florida, and I have seen the Brown Widow in the window of my neighboring apartments, one on one side of me, and one on the other. I thought I noticed the hourglass makings, but was puzzled by the brownish color. Then I did an Internet look-up and sure enough, thanks in part to both the look of the spider and egg sacs, I learned for sure they are the Brown Widow.
I told my apartment managers to be on the look out for them, but they don’t seem to be all that worried as they are still there. Well, I know I have done my part. Hopefully nothing will happen to anyone because of them.
When our lanai on the West Coast of FL became infested with small brown spiders (w/hourglass markings), we contacted the FL Dept of Agriculture. They explained that the egg sacks (which can produce up to 400 young) and look like little velcro balls had been borne aloft on the upper winds of Hurricane Andrew from Africa. The spiders then rapidly moved across the FL peninsula.
Once we became aware of them, we began to see the egg sacks everywhere! The Dept of Ag said they are smaller and non-aggressive, but their bite is more toxic than a black widow’s. We later heard that Ag never publicized this infestation widely so as not to inhibit tourism. Am sorry to learn that these nasty, venomous critters have moved across the US. As a person who suffers from arachnophobia, I have since returned to NY. Absolutely love the snow and ice, knowing that I don’t have to be on the lookout for the brown widows!
I have heard and seen on the internet conflicting facts of weather the brown widow or black widow is more poisonous…I really would like to know since i have no car nor live within walking distance to a hospital. I
have 4 children and we just found a brown widow yesterday right outside our door on the frame outside. my kids are not afraid of bugs though I warn them here in Florida bugs are more likely to be poisonous then when we lived in NY, also this thing was HUGE!
the abdomen alone was just shy of the size of a nickle. but it had the definite red hour glass on its underside (haha fun trying to get my arachnophobic self to turn it over!!!)